Major Depression Rating in VA Disability Claims (General) Forum

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Major Depression Rating

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ecxpa

Major Depression Rating

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Posts: 897

Jun 30 11 2:46 PM

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Had my 2d psych eval today. Psych diagnosis is Major Depression. Is there a percentage rating that is usually associated with major depression. It seems that anytime a question is asked about this everybody refers to the mental health parameters in CFR 38. It seems that major depression should be associated with a certain percentage level. I see posters here with MDD in their signature line and it seems the percentage they are receiving varies; don't think I've seen one below 50%. So how can someone with the same diagnosis and disability have different percentage ratings. I doubt seriously that any psychiatrists address each issue in the mental health parameters during an evaluation; they would possibly do this during a C&P exam. Anybody with diagnosis of major depression care to share their ratings.

How am I today? Too early to tell and too late to make a difference........and who cares anyway.

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BrokenSoldier244th

#1

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Posts: 1546

Jun 30 11 3:03 PM

ecxpa-it depends on the CFR. If you look at the mental disabilities area of the CFR the percentages note things like "occupational impairment" or "cognitive function", and examples of limitations of those things. The percentages vary based on your ability to function with or without those various impairments. Look through your SOAP notes or your treatment notes and look for the various statements. If you look they will start to jump out at you and you can see how they line up with the general rating formula. There is only 1 rating under mental health-the worst condition, or combination of conditions is what is rated.

I have a claim pending right now, so I can't give you my rating, but I hope this helps.

General Rating Formula for Mental Disorders:

Total occupational and social impairment, due to such symptoms as: gross impairment in thought processes or communication; persistent delusions or hallucinations; grossly inappropriate behavior; persistent danger of hurting self or others; intermittent inability to perform activities of daily living (including maintenance of minimal personal hygiene); disorientation to time or place; memory loss for names of close relatives, own occupation, or own name 100

Occupational and social impairment, with deficiencies in most areas, such as work, school, family relations, judgment, thinking, or mood, due to such symptoms as: suicidal ideation; obsessional rituals which interfere with routine activities; speech intermittently illogical, obscure, or irrelevant; near-continuous panic or depression affecting the ability to function independently, appropriately and effectively; impaired impulse control (such as unprovoked irritability with periods of violence); spatial disorientation; neglect of personal appearance and hygiene; difficulty in adapting to stressful circumstances (including work or a worklike setting); inability to establish and maintain effective relationships 70

Occupational and social impairment with reduced reliability and productivity due to such symptoms as: flattened affect; circumstantial, circumlocutory, or stereotyped speech; panic attacks more than once a week; difficulty in understanding complex commands; impairment of short- and long-term memory (e.g., retention of only highly learned material, forgetting to complete tasks); impaired judgment; impaired abstract thinking; disturbances of motivation and mood; difficulty in establishing and maintaining effective work and social relationships 50

Occupational and social impairment with occasional decrease in work efficiency and intermittent periods of inability to perform occupational tasks (although generally functioning satisfactorily, with routine behavior, self-care, and conversation normal), due to such symptoms as: depressed mood, anxiety, suspiciousness, panic attacks (weekly or less often), chronic sleep impairment, mild memory loss (such as forgetting names, directions, recent events) 30
Occupational and social impairment due to mild or transient symptoms which decrease work efficiency and ability to perform occupational tasks only during periods of significant stress, or; symptoms controlled by continuous medication 10

A mental condition has been formally diagnosed, but symptoms are not severe enough either to interfere with occupational and social functioning or to require continuous medication 0

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ecxpa

#2

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Posts: 897

Jun 30 11 3:33 PM

Thankx brokensoldier; good luck. Anybody else with a rating for major depression who would share percentage rating

How am I today? Too early to tell and too late to make a difference........and who cares anyway.

deemac76

#3

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Posts: 57

Jun 30 11 5:19 PM

Well mine is 30% MDD/Anxiety secondary to chronic back pain. I have a increase pending because of symptoms has manifested into MDD with psychotic features and panic disorder with agoraphobia. But hey good luck to ya fellow vet!

ecxpa

#4

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Posts: 897

Jun 30 11 7:12 PM

thankx deemac; seems to me like there would be some consistency with that diagnosis and all ratings should be similar. I mean I could understand, major depression, moderate depression, and mild depression getting different ratings and maybe they do. But all I've seen posted is MDD 30%, 10%, 70%, I guess they would all have the same initials, I mean take your pick of what MDD stands for major, mild, or moderate depression disorder. Even with the guidelines set in CFR it is all still confusing to me. Likewise good luck to you on your quest

How am I today? Too early to tell and too late to make a difference........and who cares anyway.

The Old Medic

#5

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Posts: 6231

Jun 30 11 7:28 PM

Major Depression can be anywhere from mildly disabling to totally disabling. It will actually depend on exactly how he says you are disabled by your Major Depression. What areas of your life are affected, and exactly how he says they are affected.

That's where the CFR comes in. The rating will be based on how your particular symptoms/problems fit into the CFR.

US Army 1959-1969; SFC E-7 MOS: 55G10 (60-63) , 91B40, 91C40, 91F40 (64-69)
Ed.D in Rehabilitation Counseling, Certified Rehabilitation Counselor Retired, Licensed Clinical Psychologist, Independent Social Security Contract Vocational Expert 1983-2005, Contract Medical Expert 1987-2005
80% Service Connected Disabled; Life Member of the DAV since 1980

LouF

#6

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Posts: 12984

Jun 30 11 7:38 PM

10,000 plus post...

I filed for PTSD but the major symptom I fell was depression due to a lot of PTSD issues as well as my health, all the shrinks seemed to a agree that iwas PTSD with MDD, I guess I am just a bit crazy but the happy pills sure help but they would only give me 50%

Lou SSG
Santa Fe NM
4/21 11LIB Americal
1/69-8/70
50% PTSD
60% IHD
100% IU P&T

BDMP858

#7

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Posts: 901

Jun 30 11 7:44 PM

Just look at the ratings for PTSD, everyone is effected in a different way by the same exact disorder, so there can not be an absolute rating level. MDD for one person may be totally debilitating to the point they are a shut in and can not take care of themselves. For others, it may just mean a night or two during the month they are not able to sleep well. The widely varying ratings show this in action. It really boils down the skill and effort that is put in by the person's doctor, to what extent their symptoms are recorded and available for the rating person to establish the proper level. Do not get hung on up on the doc saying you have major, moderate, minor...the thing that matters is the diagnosis of MDD, and the symptoms that have been established.

Also mental health awards are set up in the following percentages only: 0,10,30,50,70,100. Those are the only ratings that you can be placed in and in some cases it could reflect a combined rating of two disorders that have been combined like MDD and Anxiety Disorder, but you only get the one rating of 30% just as an example. I think having a totally uniform rating system for everyone would actually end up hurting the ones that are border line, in this current system they can account for the severity. But that is just my opinion, sure others will see it differently.

ecxpa

#8

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Posts: 897

Jun 30 11 8:06 PM

BDMP858 wrote:
everyone is effected in a different way by the same exact disorder, so there can not be an absolute rating level. MDD for one person may be totally debilitating to the point they are a shut in and can not take care of themselves. For others, it may just mean a night or two during the month they are not able to sleep well.

My case in point exactly,why would something that is totally disabling not be considered major depression, whereas something that is minimally disabling should be characterized as a mild depressive disorder. It's just hard to believe that the VA has a system where all depressive disorders are treated the same. but evidently they are from what I can get from this board. Certainly in the civilian world, depression is not treated this way. For example people with major depression usually end up getting meds and counseling, whereas those with mild may get either but generally not both.

How am I today? Too early to tell and too late to make a difference........and who cares anyway.

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BDMP858

#9

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Posts: 901

Jun 30 11 8:26 PM

I think you getting tripped up on the DSM-IV terminology, Major Depressive Disorder is the name of the diagnosis, it does not imply the severity of it. And the DSM-IV is a civilian publication that is written primarily by civilian psychologists and psychiatrists. The treatment is a totally different animal and if your being seen by a psychologist they can not prescribe medications, they are not MD's...they are PHD's, these are the doc's that do talk therapy. If your looking for drugs you need to see a psychiatrist who is an MD and can prescribe medications. I have not heard of a special way the VA handles depression, it does it the same way as all mental health professional do, there are guidelines they follow and they are the same in the VA as they are in the civilian world. If you go to the mental health board that is other than PTSD, there are quite a few good guys on there that can give you more information. A few of them are even retired docs from the VA and Private Practice. Good luck!

ecxpa

#10

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Posts: 897

Jun 30 11 8:32 PM

duhhhhhhh.........VA and civilian docs use the same ICD9 and DSM-IV codes. The DSM-IV code for Major Depressive Disorder has very specific paramaters. The VA evidently dumps 'em all in the same pot.

How am I today? Too early to tell and too late to make a difference........and who cares anyway.

Edited 1 time by ecxpa Jun 30 11 8:36 PM.

BDMP858

#11

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Posts: 901

Jun 30 11 8:55 PM

ok someone else's turn....lol sorry I could not help ya out with the answer you wanted.

ecxpa

#12

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Posts: 897

Jun 30 11 9:34 PM

BDMP858 wrote:
ok someone else's turn....lol sorry I could not help ya out with the answer you wanted.

only answer I have been looking for is........what percentage have some folks with Major Depresssion been rated at....period. I only asked what people with MDD are referring to is it Major Depressive Disorder on this board

How am I today? Too early to tell and too late to make a difference........and who cares anyway.

Edited 1 time by ecxpa Jun 30 11 9:38 PM.

The Old Medic

#13

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Posts: 6231

Jul 1 11 1:49 AM

No, the VA does NOT just "dump them all into the same pot". They use the exact same diagnostic criteria as any other entity, and they may diagnose a person as having several different psychiatric disorders.

You are confusing a Service Connected Mental Disability rating with diagnosis and treatment. You can ONLY be service connected for one condition, usually whichever is the worst. There is absolutely no advantage to having a PTSD rating instead of MDD, it all depends on how your particular mental disorders disable YOU.

AND, you did NOT ask what anyone else was rated for MDD. You asked how different people with the same diagnosis could have different disability ratings (go back and read your first note)? It has been explained to you, by several of us, that the DIAGNOSIS does not directly have anything to do with how you are rated. Your rating will depend on HOW YOUR PARTICULAR MENTAL CONDITION IS AFFECTING YOU, and what your doctors (and the C&P exam) indicate that your symptoms are doing that is causing a disability for you.

Major Depressive Disorder, as is the case with all other mental disorders, can vary a LOT in how it affects a person. There simply is no one rating that you automatically get, because you have that diagnosis (or PTSD, or Schizophrenia, or Bi-Polar Disorder, etc., etc.). That's what you seem to have difficulty understanding, that it can affect you very differently from one period of time to another.

US Army 1959-1969; SFC E-7 MOS: 55G10 (60-63) , 91B40, 91C40, 91F40 (64-69)
Ed.D in Rehabilitation Counseling, Certified Rehabilitation Counselor Retired, Licensed Clinical Psychologist, Independent Social Security Contract Vocational Expert 1983-2005, Contract Medical Expert 1987-2005
80% Service Connected Disabled; Life Member of the DAV since 1980

ecxpa

#14

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Posts: 897

Jul 1 11 4:44 AM

The Old Medic wrote:
No, the VA does NOT just "dump them all into the same pot". They use the exact same diagnostic criteria as any other entity, and they may diagnose a person as having several different psychiatric disorders.

You are confusing a Service Connected Mental Disability rating with diagnosis and treatment. You can ONLY be service connected for one condition, usually whichever is the worst. There is absolutely no advantage to having a PTSD rating instead of MDD, it all depends on how your particular mental disorders disable YOU.

Looks like this mule is dead; too much smoke around here; I'm pretty sure I have seen Vets here post with more than one service connected mental disorder; could be wrong though. Not going to get anyone who has a dx of major depression to post their rating so I'll just move on.

How am I today? Too early to tell and too late to make a difference........and who cares anyway.

broncovet

#15

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Posts: 993

Jul 1 11 10:30 PM

I

To take a guess at your rating, you can put down your symptoms and see how they relate to the rating schedule for mental disorders.

While there are many mental disorders, MDD, schizo, bipolar PTSD, etc. they are all rated on the symptoms in the rating schedule. Altho you can have multiple disorders, the rating schedule accounts for symptoms.

As far as what your rating will be for MDD, it depends on your symptoms and they vary widely. MDD can be mild, with few symptoms or it can be totally disabling.

It is correct, that "Major Depressive Disorder" does not describe the severity. MDD is a fancy name for Depression.

Vike17

#16

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Posts: 1979

Feb 16 13 12:25 AM

This thread is a year and a half old.

Thread closed.

Vike 17

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